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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I just installed renegade ready wheel spacers on my trailhawk. (25 mm).

I was looking at tire options. It looks like the Yokohama Geolander A/T in a 225/65R17 keeps coming up in discussions and is a good looking tire.

Has anyone considered the Toyo Open country A/T in a 235/60R17?

The diameter difference would only be .4% vs. the Yokohama size at 1.8%.

Any pros or cons to the 235/60R17's I should know about?
 

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I was eventually going to test fit 235/65/17 to show how much room there isn't, and a few folks have already done 225/65/17 ATSs. We don't sell Toyo, but just from experience there's better than a Toyo.

With a shorter sidewall, you will get crisper handling, but losing sidewall means a little more possibility on curb rash. AT tires do help protect that, but not sure about Toyo sidewall coverage. Spacers should fit a 235/60 with no issue from what others have already done, but once I get to test fit (slow day needed, haven't been to work since I took delivery friday?) we'll have more visual proof of how much tire can be shoved in these wheel wells. Sans trimming, as I'm not doing that to mine quite yet ?.
 

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With a shorter sidewall, you will get crisper handling, but losing sidewall means a little more possibility on curb rash.
Yes, it's a lower sidewall ratio but the width is also wider. With the wheel width being the constant here. The wider tire will balloon a little more, and that will help protect the rim.

215/65 calculates to a 139.75 mm sidewall. 235/60 calculates to a 141mm sidewall. The difference is marginal at best. With overall diameter of only 0.1" larger than stock. 225/65 is 146.25mm. A difference of just 5.25mm or 0.207" to the 235/60.

I'm thinking 235/60 is probably a good combo for better appearance, handling and better traction off-pavement. Add a 1" or 2" lift, good to go! Your combined 24 mpg will probably suffer by 1 or 2 though. But, gas is cheap... for now.

Geolanders are decent, but dig a little online and you'll see that it is mediocre for on-pavement compared to other ATs available. No personal experience with Toyo's AT, but have experience with their street performance tires (quite decent).
 

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Also, another tire spec worth noting, weight. Rotational mass increases exponentially with speed. It makes the biggest impact in handling and ride quality. Greater rotational mass will affect steering and suspension response and rob power.

I don't see 235/60-17 on Toyo's site. Is it new?
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Thanks tx and fmunk for your responses!

I wasn't sure how popular that 60 size would be in an all terrain so I just typed 235/60 r17 a-t into my browser and the toyo open country popped up at the top.... I didn't check the Toyo website as I haven't had any prior experience with Toyo.... It was just my first hit.

tire weight is a good point....especially with the spacers.... the toyo tire weighs 31 pds... does anyone know what the stock tires weigh?
 

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Geolanders are decent, but dig a little online and you'll see that it is mediocre for on-pavement compared to other ATs available. No personal experience with Toyo's AT, but have experience with their street performance tires (quite decent).
I'm going off experience here, on road traction felt almost as good as my Michelin Latitude HPs did on my grand Cherokee. And that was a 245, as I was running a 235 on my old XJ. Even in wet weather I couldn't get those Yokohamas to break loose, unless I really dropped the clutch. Never used them in any more than a dirt path, and barely got to play around then.. Just for on road ride quality, lack of noise, and looks, they work well. I've got a mechanic who's at about 25k and he smoked his rears already (2500 Hd ram with 'upgrades') but his other 2 are about 7-632nds
 

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Not that the size will fit a Rene, but to attest to the fitness of Toyo tires -- I've been running the Toyo A/T Open Country's (235/70x16) on my Zuki for years. They've been great tires for me, both off and on the road. Good compromise, long wear. minimal road noise, adequate off-road traction.
 

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Thanks tx and fmunk for your responses!

I wasn't sure how popular that 60 size would be in an all terrain so I just typed 235/60 r17 a-t into my browser and the toyo open country popped up at the top.... I didn't check the Toyo website as I haven't had any prior experience with Toyo.... It was just my first hit.

tire weight is a good point....especially with the spacers.... the toyo tire weighs 31 pds... does anyone know what the stock tires weigh?
Spacers aren't much of a problem for rotational weight since the additional mass is close about axis of rotation. It's the revolving mass that is further out from the axis that matter more. What the spacers contribute to is unsprung weight, which impacts suspension response. Although factory shocks are generally tuned to over dampen I don't to foresee this to be much of an issue.

And, FWIW, for most average joes the Yoko Geolander ATs are probably more than good enough. I was just saying there are others that have been rated better. The BFG Longtrail all-season radials on my Element took me across the Nevada desert and mountain trails on several occasions without issue. For casual off pavement excursions, all terrain tires aren't a must-have (especially if the vehicle spends less than 10% of its working life off-road). If you just want slightly better appearance and wider footprint/stance, ATs (and the hit on fuel economy) might just be overkill.
 

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Thanks tx and fmunk for your responses!

I wasn't sure how popular that 60 size would be in an all terrain so I just typed 235/60 r17 a-t into my browser and the toyo open country popped up at the top.... I didn't check the Toyo website as I haven't had any prior experience with Toyo.... It was just my first hit.

tire weight is a good point....especially with the spacers.... the toyo tire weighs 31 pds... does anyone know what the stock tires weigh?
I was poking around the web last night and came across two options in 235/60/17. Cooper Discoverer AT and Bridgestone Dueler AT. Both under $200/tire. The Cooper is decidedly more aggressive looking (pronounced side lugs) than the Bridgestone. The latter look just like any all season tire at the shoulder of the tread; might be more on-road/hwy friendly.

Section width difference to the stock 215/65/17 is only 0.79" with all other specs well under 1%. It might just work with minimal rubbing... with or without spacers.
 

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Know that I'm digging-up an older thread here...

Has anyone tried 235/60-17 tires on the factory Trailhawk wheels without any kind of lift or spacer?

I'm figuring that since people are commenting on rubbing the fender liners with the spacer due to the greater sweep of the steering knuckle, with stock position of the wheel relative to the hub this may not be as big of an issue. The 235s are 20mm wider than the 215s, and divided in-half for the outside versus inside that's 10mm, or a little over 3/8". Obviously it would depend on the clearance between the strut and the tire, but if that spacing is over a half-inch then this might be workable.
 

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My Trailhawk has 6.5 in wide rims and I believe the widest tire recommended on a 6.5 in wide rim is a 225.
 

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The 235s are 20mm wider than the 215s, and divided in-half for the outside versus inside that's 10mm, or a little over 3/8". Obviously it would depend on the clearance between the strut and the tire, but if that spacing is over a half-inch then this might be workable.
Not just 10mm wider, tyre sidewall is 12mm higher.
Nr. "60" in tyre specification means height is 60% of tyre width.

My TH also came with 6,5x17 rims.
 

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16x6.5? I thought ive read somewhere the stock rims were 16x7...
My rims are 17", which I thought all Trailhawks were, but the point I'm making is if you want to go over 225 mm wide then you should consider getting new rims. Here is a chart I copied that says with a 6.5 in wide rim the max is a 215 mm tire: The first column is the rim width and the last column is the max tire width, my cut and paste didn't format correctly.

Rim
width
(inch) Min.
tire
width
(mm) Ideal
tire
width
(mm) Max.
tire
width
(mm)
5,0 155 165 or 175 185
5,5 165 175 or 185 195
6,0 175 185 or 195 205
6,5 185 195 or 205 215
7,0 195 205 or 215 225
7,5 205 215 or 225 235
8,0 215 225 or 235 245
8,5 225 235 or 245 255
9,0 235 245 or 255 265
9,5 245 255 or 265 275
10,0 255 265 or 275 285
 

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Not just 10mm wider, tyre sidewall is 12mm higher.
Nr. "60" in tyre specification means height is 60% of tyre width.

My TH also came with 6,5x17 rims.
I don't entirely get your 12mm higher statement.

Comparisons of the two tires:

Code:
Specification  Sidewall  Radius  Diameter  Circumference  Revs/Mile  Difference
215/65-17         5.5in  14.0in    28.0in         88.0in        720        0.0%
235/60-17         5.6in  14.1in    28.1in         88.3in        718        0.4%

215/65-17         140mm   356mm     711mm         2235mm        448        0.0%
235/60-17         141mm   357mm     714mm         2242mm        446        0.4%
The rolling circumference of the 215-65-series is essentially the same as of the 235-60-series, the 0.4% is lost in the margin-of-error for the manufacturing and air pressure tolerances. That's why it just becomes a width issue.

My Trailhawk has 6.5 in wide rims and I believe the widest tire recommended on a 6.5 in wide rim is a 225.
I've run 255/60 tires on 15x7 wheels. They're a bit wide but it works well enough. I would not be afraid to run a 235/60 tire on a 6.5" wide wheel so long as I had clearance against the fender well or suspension.
 

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I don't entirely get your 12mm higher statement.

Comparisons of the two tires:

Code:
Specification  Sidewall  Radius  Diameter  Circumference  Revs/Mile  Difference
215/65-17         5.5in  14.0in    28.0in         88.0in        720        0.0%
235/60-17         5.6in  14.1in    28.1in         88.3in        718        0.4%

[/quote]

Sorry, I was calculating difference between 215/60 and 235/60. In Europe we have TH stock size 215/60.
 

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My rims are 17", which I thought all Trailhawks were, but the point I'm making is if you want to go over 225 mm wide then you should consider getting new rims. Here is a chart I copied that says with a 6.5 in wide rim the max is a 215 mm tire: The first column is the rim width and the last column is the max tire width, my cut and paste didn't format correctly.

Rim
width
(inch) Min.
tire
width
(mm) Ideal
tire
width
(mm) Max.
tire
width
(mm)
5,0 155 165 or 175 185
5,5 165 175 or 185 195
6,0 175 185 or 195 205
6,5 185 195 or 205 215
7,0 195 205 or 215 225
7,5 205 215 or 225 235
8,0 215 225 or 235 245
8,5 225 235 or 245 255
9,0 235 245 or 255 265
9,5 245 255 or 265 275
10,0 255 265 or 275 285
Sorry I misread, yes all TrailHawks should come with 17" wheels. I was thinking of the stock latitude wheels that are 16"s.
 

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Sorry I misread, yes all TrailHawks should come with 17" wheels. I was thinking of the stock latitude wheels that are 16"s.
The UK equivalent of the Latitude is the Longitude, which I have and that comes with 17" rims as standard. The 16" rims are the same pattern as the 17".
 

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I don't know if this is useful or not, but when I had my Trailhawk up on the lift yesterday, wheels dangling, I used various sockets to determine the approximate distance between the strut and the tire. Basically I ran the sockets horizontally along the strut until I got to the tire, and noted the outside thickness with a vernier calipers of the largest one that cleared.

The front tires were 0.8" or about 20mm from the front struts. The rear tires were 0.6" or 15mm from the rear struts. In both cases I have rounded down, not rounded up.

This is when the wheels were dangling at the extent of their normal suspension travel. When compressed at ride-height I expect the gap to only grow, as the lower control arm won't dangle as far from its pivot at the body.

So, if a 215/65/17 is indeed 215mm wide, and a 235/60/17 is indeed 235mm wide, then the difference at the inside should be 10mm, which means that statically parked the tire should not contact the strut at the sidewall. Now, 10mm clearance in front and 5mm clearance in back is pretty tight, but I've read on forums for other vehicles where tires were 3/16" from the strut and it worked. That's .1875", or a little under 5mm.

I am not going to outright endorse blindly putting a 235/60/17 in place of a 215/65/17, but if my first set of tires was worn-out and if the stock tires were pretty expensive, I would not have a problem asking the service manager at the tire shop to test-fit the 235, especially since that 6.5" wide wheel might help narrow-in that section width just a hair.
 
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