[timsvtgen1]

Has anyone who has a dart now with a 2.4L or an Abarth with a 1.4L care to share what oil they are using? I'm kinda an "Bob is the oil guy" type guy (if you had heard of that, you understand what I mean) and would like to get some sort of oil thread going.

1.4l t- 5W-40 spec (MS-12991) New spec to me..
2.4l - 0W-20 spec (MS-6395) Which isn't too picky.

Besides for what the manual mentions ( Pennzoil and Shell) Anyone have any input?

Looks like Kendall Full Synthetic w/Ti 0W-20 would be good.. its only like 50 a case of 12.....That's half the price of M1 and Pennzoil

But for the 1.4t?

 

[DogsRule]

But for the 1.4t?

My oil expert says RotellaT6. For all the right reasons. Zinc, breakdown, interval, etc. The WRX guys run it in their turbos. Again, go to Bob's website and lets get some UOA posted for this 1.4turbo.

 

[timsvtgen1]

My oil expert says RotellaT6. For all the right reasons. Zinc, breakdown, interval, etc. The WRX guys run it in their turbos. Again, go to Bob's website and lets get some UOA posted for this 1.4turbo.

Been dabbling around and its seems to be a mess.. and a few fights on what is best. T6 is a great oil, and I'd prob use it .. However, as far as I can tell, they do not list Chrysler MS-12991 in their specs to meet the minimum standards Fiat specifies for that engine

 

[DogsRule]

Been dabbling around and its seems to be a mess.. and a few fights on what is best. T6 is a great oil, and I'd prob use it .. However, as far as I can tell, they do not list Chrysler MS-12991 in their specs to meet the minimum standards Fiat specifies for that engine

True. And even I wouldn't want to botch a 100k engine warranty. Great oil, just not warranty-able with Fiat. Because Fiat'll want receipts and barcodes to match oil change records (if you DIY).

So back to what is said earlier....

 

[Indiana Jones]

I have an Abarth and use factory recommended oil. Remember the intakes valves are actuated by oil pressure. So if you don't use factory recommended oil and something goes screwy with the valve train it could void your warranty.

 

[timsvtgen1]

Yea, I understand the Multiair is the reason for that spec. like Indiana Jones said... Which is funny, because the 2.4L which also uses that technology, uses the much more common ( and not necessarily overly stringent) MS-6395 spec.. I'm starting to think the 1.4's spec is just a matter of it being a weird one what wasn't used in the US much . Hopefully more brands will come avail.

 

[bwbike]

The oil for the 1.4 is likely specified specifically since it has a turbo. Turbochargers are usually lubricated by oil and the specific oil may be needed to ensure proper oil flow in that harsh (hot) environment.

 

[raz-0]

The oil for the 1.4 is likely specified specifically since it has a turbo. Turbochargers are usually lubricated by oil and the specific oil may be needed to ensure proper oil flow in that harsh (hot) environment.

This is likely it in large part. On my subaru, oil activates the variable valve timing. Coking of oil from turbo heat created enough carbon buildup that it would start clogging the mesh filters in the engine designed to protect a couple of systems, the variable valve timing being one of them.

Using bulk dino juice and a 3500 mile interval was enough to keep me out of trouble. People who were picky about oil, but followed the 7k interval with a turbo were not so lucky.

Fiat clearly cares wabout turbo heat if they have a water circulation pump that runs post shutoff. A turbo small enough not to spool really late on a 1.4 and pushing 22 psi is going to be spinning FAST. Likely well over 100k rpm at peak boost. 22psi and fast spinning means heat and strain on the lubricant.

 

[DogsRule]

This is likely it in large part. On my subaru, oil activates the variable valve timing. Coking of oil from turbo heat created enough carbon buildup that it would start clogging the mesh filters in the engine designed to protect a couple of systems, the variable valve timing being one of them.

Using bulk dino juice and a 3500 mile interval was enough to keep me out of trouble. People who were picky about oil, but followed the 7k interval with a turbo were not so lucky.

Fiat clearly cares wabout turbo heat if they have a water circulation pump that runs post shutoff. A turbo small enough not to spool really late on a 1.4 and pushing 22 psi is going to be spinning FAST. Likely well over 100k rpm at peak boost. 22psi and fast spinning means heat and strain on the lubricant.

My SAE expert says for me to change my synthetic every 5k. Use the spec needed for warranty. Keep records/barcodes for proof. He says Fiat valvetrains need clean oil and anything over 5K isnt. But to be sure, go to whatever the oil meter says and send to Blackstone for a UOA and the special one for oil condition to see when you could/should change oil. I'll let my first oil go to 10k? or whatever the meter says and send it in. Should be interesting.

 

[lamont]

Has anyone who has a dart now with a 2.4L or an Abarth with a 1.4L care to share what oil they are using? I'm kinda an "Bob is the oil guy" type guy (if you had heard of that, you understand what I mean) and would like to get some sort of oil thread going.

If you are a BITO-kind-of-guy (Do you have the mandatory minimum 50 quart oil stash?), and if you are looking for Dart and Barth owners why don't you ask your question on BITOG (over 50k members) or on a dedicated Dart or Abarth forum? There already are several oil threads pertaining to the 1.4T and 2.4 l engine on these forums here, all of which can be found via the forum search function:

http://www.jeeprenegadeforum.com/fo.../37081-engine-oil-specs-2-4-l.html#post383905

http://www.jeeprenegadeforum.com/forum/426-maintenance-service/36569-oil-type-2.html#post401929

 

[DogsRule]

This is likely it in large part. On my subaru, oil activates the variable valve timing. Coking of oil from turbo heat created enough carbon buildup that it would start clogging the mesh filters in the engine designed to protect a couple of systems, the variable valve timing being one of them.

Using bulk dino juice and a 3500 mile interval was enough to keep me out of trouble. People who were picky about oil, but followed the 7k interval with a turbo were not so lucky.

Fiat clearly cares wabout turbo heat if they have a water circulation pump that runs post shutoff. A turbo small enough not to spool really late on a 1.4 and pushing 22 psi is going to be spinning FAST. Likely well over 100k rpm at peak boost. 22psi and fast spinning means heat and strain on the lubricant.

Hello raz-o. do our 1.4L turbo oil feed tubes have those screen filters?

 

[raz-0]

Hello raz-o. do our 1.4L turbo oil feed tubes have those screen filters?

No idea. Even if they did, they don't have the same turbos, so the plumbing is different.

 

[DogsRule]

No idea. Even if they did, they don't have the same turbos, so the plumbing is different.

Well, thats nice to know. Any specs/make on ours?

I understand Fiat had micromesh filters in the oil feel tube a while back. And I'm being very general here as I'm tracking down the story. Oil gets coked up, clogs the filter. Turbo starvation. So I think both turbos are good, its just the oil may not be in as good a shape as the oil indicators suggest.

Perhaps thats why we have coolant timers now?

 

[lamont]

With a turbo engine, maintaining proper oil flow and film strength is surely most critical to long turbo life. Adequate flow is maintained by running clean oil, which has not yet

- sheared (loss of film strength due to reduction in viscosity, which happens due to mechanical shearing over time and due to age) too much
- begun to break down and leaves nasty deposits (sludge, resinous compounds that impede adequate oil flow)
- has not yet been contaminated with particles that will score bearing surfaces (make sure the engine air filter system is in good shape and use only high quality oil filters)

One of the most important things with a turbo engine is keeping the oil cool, since high heat will deteriorate the oil. Hence, turbo engines often come with fans and coolant pumps that will keep running for a while after the engine has been shut off. Otherwise heat buildup puts the turbo at risk. Like an N/A engine, a turbo engine should not be shut off immediately after driving hard, but should be left idling a little.

With a turbo engine I'd be especially anal about figuring out the appropriate oil change interval via UOA. I would also use only oil that meets or exceeds the required specs and has the car manufacturer's approval rating.

 

[kevinfourlegs]

Also to prolong the life of a turbo, is to let the engine idle before shutting the engine off, especially a long run or high speed driving. Shutting the engine down immediately is a surefire way to cause turbo failure. I have seen turbos fail due to this, as well as lack of oil changes. Always take time to read the owners' manual, many do not.

 

[Stephen Hayko]

1.4l t- 5W-40 spec (MS-12991) New spec to me..

That's the same as we had to run in my wife's 2.0T Passat. It's pretty common for high boost turbo applications.

 

[DogsRule]

It's pretty common for high boost turbo applications.

LOL. Reminded me of my old high detonation turbo application. 1980 Pontiac Turbo Trans Am with a 305 Garrett at 9psi. But it was a draw-through where it sucked air thru the 4bbl (that's barrels children) carb, and took the air/fuel combo and then compressed that. I have no idea how we all didn't die from explosion. Cooled with hot 10W40 engine oil with no water jacket cooling. Had to idle for a minute or two to cool the turbo. But as the turbo cooled, so did your girlfiend. So noone ever waited. Often coked up the oil passeges and failed. That's all on that engineer DeLorean.

 

[Stephen Hayko]

LOL. Reminded me of my old high detonation turbo application. 1980 Pontiac Turbo Trans Am with a 305 Garrett at 9psi. But it was a draw-through where it sucked air thru the 4bbl (that's barrels children) carb, and took the air/fuel combo and then compressed that. I have no idea how we all didn't die from explosion. Cooled with hot 10W40 engine oil with no water jacket cooling. Had to idle for a minute or two to cool the turbo. But as the turbo cooled, so did your girlfiend. So noone ever waited. Often coked up the oil passeges and failed. That's all on that engineer DeLorean.

My first car was an 81 Firebird Esprit. I never saw a Gen 2 Turbo T/A until I was almost out of high school. There were still plenty of the 400 or Olds 403 cars running around then, too. (I'm 37 - graduated high school in 96)

 

[raz-0]

Also to prolong the life of a turbo, is to let the engine idle before shutting the engine off, especially a long run or high speed driving. Shutting the engine down immediately is a surefire way to cause turbo failure. I have seen turbos fail due to this, as well as lack of oil changes. Always take time to read the owners' manual, many do not.

This is to reduce the exposure of the oil in the turbo to sustained heat.

If the turbo has a coolant pump that runs after the engine is off, this shouldn't be necessary. Someone stated on here the 1.4 has such a pump. If correct, doing this is not necessary.

 

[lamont]

While not necessary with an after-run coolant pump, letting the engine idle for maybe 30 seconds before shutting down will still help reduce initial heat build-up, so it's still a good thing.