[CalTom]

Well the reviews are in, many of us really like the Renegade and want to buy one. Many new forum members are happy with their Renegade.

However, many of the forum members are not so lucky, with a number of issues being posted by some of the beta tester forum members, howling wind noise, smoking steering columns, key cylinders falling out, Renegade's in the shop for weeks, random software issues, several forum members being given the shaft on buy back of defective units..., you get the picture?

Unfortunately, it is beginning to look like our hope that FCA/Fiat/Jeep would have learned their lesson and improved quality was nothing but a pipe dream.

It seems like the only solution to the problem is for Toyota to come through with the rumored Toyota mini RAV4 4x4 / FJ Cruiser replacement?

What are the chances of that or maybe you have a better solution?

 

[JRousey]

Details/Links to the Toyota you are talking about? I tried googling that but never found anything. My wife really liked the FJ Cruisers but they were just a little larger than we needed.

 

[Hmmm!!!]

I have a FJ Cruiser, got it in 2006 as a 2007 model. I use it to tow my sailboat. Just love it. For a 4 wheel drive SUV it gets fantastic mpg's around town and on the highway. Has great power to go up any mountain. And when I tow my boat up a big bridge it's like there's nothing behind me. My boat and trailer together weigh 4800 pounds. I had them weighed one year when I had to get it out of town to avoid a hurricane. It's rated to tow 5,000 pounds. Right now I have 110,000 miles on it and have never had one single problem with it. I can't help but wonder why Toyota pulled the plug on that great truck.

 

[CalTom]

Details/Links to the Toyota you are talking about? I tried googling that but never found anything. My wife really liked the FJ Cruisers but they were just a little larger than we needed.

It has just been a whispered rumor discussed on forums over the last couple of years. It is hard to track down, I looked and of course knowing the term to search for makes it hard.

One mentioned mini FJ, another mentioned a RAV4 size 4x4 offroader, so they may have both been speaking about the same thing.

I agree, and thanks to Hmmm as well, I love the FJ Cruisers but they are just to large for what I want.

 

[Lackadazikal]

I love the FJ Cruisers but they are just to large for what I want.

Same here - love the look of them. Just a tad too big for me. But I was surprised they discontinued it.

Still not sure I'd ever own a non-Jeep. If anything I'd go back to driving an old, original XJ.

 

[CalTom]

Still not sure I'd ever own a non-Jeep. If anything I'd go back to driving an old, original XJ.

I understand, but 99.9% of the market is not going to buy a 15 to 20 year old vehicle.

The FJ Cruiser and Hummers may have failed to penetrate the Jeep Wrangler market, but the B Segment market is a new game.

Clearly Toyota has the knowledge and talent to stiffen a unibody chassis, a key to a capable offroader. Drivetrain, again, they have plenty of experience with four wheel drive.

With those things, they clearly could make a market segment winning vehicle that would challenge Jeep. Bringing their reliability to the table would clearly win people over from the random Jeep Renegade loose connectors and some of the experiences of fellow forum members such as Codev:

Hey, good luck man. We are not having too great of a time right now. We just don't want any of this anymore. We had the headunit crash a few times, and other strange things besides the window leak.

 

[codev]

I understand, but 99.9% of the market is not going to buy a 15 to 20 year old vehicle.

The FJ Cruiser and Hummers may have failed to penetrate the Jeep Wrangler market, but the B Segment market is a new game.

Clearly Toyota has the knowledge and talent to stiffen a unibody chassis, a key to a capable offroader. Drivetrain, again, they have plenty of experience with four wheel drive.

With those things, they clearly could make a market segment winning vehicle that would challenge Jeep. Bringing their reliability to the table would clearly win people over from the random Jeep Renegade loose connectors and some of the experiences of fellow forum members such as Codev:

CalTom, wherever we get to ,whether it's replacement vehicle, unwinding the loan, or whatever...will will be seeking a different vehicle. I'm a mechanic and I knew this could be a gamble going in. I guess I was hopeful. We will probably get into a Toyota or Mazda.

I know that every car its faults, but this is an infrastructure thing. I used to work at Toyota as a tech and it never took 2 weeks to get a field tech out. Even then, there was a workflow they followed that was transparent to the customer so that both parties knew what the outcome could be... ahead of time. Basically, setting realistic expectations and not relying solely on doing things on a day by day basis.

FCA is expecting that I will surrender my vehicle to being an engineering project to them while I wait patiently driving around a rental.

Luckily, I have a nice reliable, very liveable Tundra to get my work done without worry on a day to day basis.

Additionally, I am not an emotional buyer. I don't care about the tacky garbage like the JEEP logo everywhere, or the "look" or how it makes me feel. It was simply a light cargo vehicle with light hauling and good MPG. Maybe 4WD if I really need it.

I was going to use this vehicle to transport light shop equipment to my garage where I work on my motocross bikes, motos, and my hobbies (BMW restoration). It was going to allow me to get 30mpg because my work is about 60 miles away.

If I can get out of this, I'll probably end up in a CX5 or RAV4 and just beat it up a little inside for the sake of getting my work done while keeping transport costs down. Essentially, it was going to fill the void between my Tundra and my motorcycles and Miata. Light duty towing is all that's necessary to haul my bikes, and anything bigger gets put into my Tundra.

Anyone else have a bailout plan? Would like to hear experiences on people who bought this for a specific usage.

Regards.

 

[gorgon]

Are there an unusual number of problems or does it just seem that way because this is the one place the negative posts are likely to pile up?

 

[codev]

Are there an unusual number of problems or does it just seem that way because this is the one place the negative posts are likely to pile up?

I can tell you this. I would have been amenable to change into another Renegade until the shop foreman said almost all of the Renegades they tested against mine have wind noise. Might not be as worse, but it's there. Some people just don't care, he said. He also expressed his concern that NVH should be a lot lower on this car than it is right now and many people have presented this concern to FCA already. But they still do not have a straight answer. That's why they are sending a field tech.

If you start to look at things concretely and look at what you're getting for the money, things might not add up anymore. That was my perspective at least.

 

[raz-0]

Are there an unusual number of problems or does it just seem that way because this is the one place the negative posts are likely to pile up?

I'd say given the number of members of this board, add in the fact that a number of us still don't own one, and then look at the number of problems posted, and I'd say it's got an unusual number of problems. Heck how many buy backs have we had on the board alone? Vs. all of 4000 units sold?

Some things like the poorly installed drain plugs are getting caught in PDI by decent dealers now, but many seem to be the results of sloppy assembly. Some of those have been downright dangerous like the improper transmission line installation, and the shorted out wiring harness in the steering column.

Add to that the fact the there are zero incentives on the vehicle, and even a decent dealer price is only marginally competitive with several other brands c-segment SUVs. Brands that don't have these problems. Given the lack of straight up peer competition, they could afford to be a bit pricey, or be a bit rough around the edges, but both?

 

[codev]

I'd say given the number of members of this board, add in the fact that a number of us still don't own one, and then look at the number of problems posted, and I'd say it's got an unusual number of problems. Heck how many buy backs have we had on the board alone? Vs. all of 4000 units sold?

Some things like the poorly installed drain plugs are getting caught in PDI by decent dealers now, but many seem to be the results of sloppy assembly. Some of those have been downright dangerous like the improper transmission line installation, and the shorted out wiring harness in the steering column.

Add to that the fact the there are zero incentives on the vehicle, and even a decent dealer price is only marginally competitive with several other brands c-segment SUVs. Brands that don't have these problems. Given the lack of straight up peer competition, they could afford to be a bit pricey, or be a bit rough around the edges, but both?

I agree with this whole heartedly. My fiance works at Ferrari & Mas and was appalled at the fact that the plug was missed, and that the NVH was so bad. That should have been part of PDI.

I think the part that I regret the most was that there were other CUV/SUVs that did have incentives and wouldn't have this problem.

 

[Indiana Jones]

Well the reviews are in, many of us really like the Renegade and want to buy one. Many new forum members are happy with their Renegade.

However, many of the forum members are not so lucky, with a number of issues being posted by some of the beta tester forum members, howling wind noise, smoking steering columns, key cylinders falling out, Renegade's in the shop for weeks, random software issues, several forum members being given the shaft on buy back of defective units..., you get the picture?

Unfortunately, it is beginning to look like our hope that FCA/Fiat/Jeep would have learned their lesson and improved quality was nothing but a pipe dream.

It seems like the only solution to the problem is for Toyota to come through with the rumored Toyota mini RAV4 4x4 / FJ Cruiser replacement?

What are the chances of that or maybe you have a better solution?

I'd say given the number of members of this board, add in the fact that a number of us still don't own one, and then look at the number of problems posted, and I'd say it's got an unusual number of problems. Heck how many buy backs have we had on the board alone? Vs. all of 4000 units sold?

Some things like the poorly installed drain plugs are getting caught in PDI by decent dealers now, but many seem to be the results of sloppy assembly. Some of those have been downright dangerous like the improper transmission line installation, and the shorted out wiring harness in the steering column.

Add to that the fact the there are zero incentives on the vehicle, and even a decent dealer price is only marginally competitive with several other brands c-segment SUVs. Brands that don't have these problems. Given the lack of straight up peer competition, they could afford to be a bit pricey, or be a bit rough around the edges, but both?

When you are talking about a high $20'a to low $30's vehicle this is unacceptable. This is something I would expect out of a Spark, Mirage, or a Note. Im' still hoping this is just the result of being a new vehicle design but then you look at the Cherokee and it is still having issues with the 9 speed... It is almost FCA is trying to hang themselves. Has Fiat learned nothing from 30 years ago when they had to leave the U.S.? I'm still hanging in there but the wanting is fading and really is sad FCA doesn't seam to give a flying *&^%.

CalTom I hope you are right. If you are, then I probably would choose the Toyota.

 

[JKU2Trailhawk]

Problems with completely new models aren't all that unusual. As long the dealership and Jeep take care of the issues I don't get concerned about them. My 07 Wrangler unlimited had numerous dealer repairs, my 13 Wrangler unlimited nearly had to be towed back to the dealership because of the keyless entry control unit issue. By the 14 unlimited, things worked pretty well.

If people want to drive a Toyota they should do that. Personally I find them the blandest car in the world. I would push a Nissan 10 blocks before I drove a Corolla. To each his own. FJ cruiser was a pretty cool looking car but serious viability issues didn't indear it to everyday operators. Plus the roof only came off with an air chisel.

If your a Toyota fan your probably never going to love the quirky Fiat based products or even the raw, rattle , and wind noise filled cabin of a Wrangler. Maybe Renegade drivers should just embrace the wind noise as part of the Jeep DNA and the funky electronics from mother Fiats side.

It's a fun car, it's a cool concept. Your in the first wave everybody, enjoy it. If you need something more 'safe' you can probably find an FJ used to get back and forth to the grocery store. If you get it stuck look me up, I've still got an 84 Wagoneer with an International Harvester 360, GM alternator and distributer, FoMoCo ignition module and Carb, apparently wired by the Amish. See, not much has changed.

 

[hoodoo]

Well my current vehicle is the original 2007 FJ Cruiser (purchased May 2006) so I guess I'm not afraid to buy first year models We have the manual transmission all wheel drive FJ and really enjoy driving it. Yeah visibility to the back and sides is a bit challenging it's true, but it's a blast to drive.

And I just ordered a Renegade Latitude with the manual/1.4T and Power My Sky! So it's possible to love Toyota and Jeep vehicles at the same time. What sold us on the Renegade was high MPG, manual transmission with 4WD, better back seat space than the FJ and the My Sky. I would prefer My Sky with clear panels like most others on the forum, but I have a feeling these might be found later on from aftermarket companies. We live at a ski area and face extreme snow and ice conditions, so any vehicle we purchase must offer great handling in these conditions and reviews of the Renegade are all good with respect to 4WD and off road capability.

FJ cargo space is better, but we're going to add a hitch and cargo box on the back for long trips. And we will be keeping the FJ as well.

 

[fmunk]

The FJ having good MPG? I find that hard to believe. It has the same engine as the previous 4runner and weighs over 5,000 lbs! And that V-6 in the 4runner is no gas miser.

The Renegade seems to be off to a very shaky start. Which is why I've canceled plans of buying one. The more I think about it, while it is cool, it is not cool enough to turn in a reliable drama-free Honda Element that is already paid for. I'll probably just drive that till it blows up or until the income improves to the point where I can throw caution to the wind... Maybe a diesel Wrangler instead?

 

[Eric5273]

I'd love it if Toyota came out with a smaller version of the FJ. Something around the size of a 2-door wrangler would be perfect, and make it a little bit more fuel efficient than the last FJ (I could live with 20-22 mpg combined). If they were to come out with something like that, I'd be first in line to buy one. I've owned 2 Toyotas in the past, and neither one ever visited the dealership for anything other than an oil change.

 

[CalTom]

Given the lack of straight up peer competition, they could afford to be a bit pricey, or be a bit rough around the edges, but both?

Raz, well said!

Im' still hoping this is just the result of being a new vehicle design

IJ, it is not so much that it is new, they have been building and selling them in Europe since last summer. The real issue seems to be assembly quality or I should say the lack thereof.

The workmanship seems sloppy in a number of areas, how long does it take to properly train someone to join connectors, tighten a hose clamp or glue a blindspot sensor?

Is it possible the root causes are the Italian laws and or unions? I'm not sure of the whole situation but someone said the workers got paid even with the factory was closed, if true, maybe they are not allowed to fire poor performing employees and therefore it is pot luck on how good or how bad your Renegade will be assembled?

Or, is it the work ethic, out of sight, out of mind? That would explain the many hidden odd faults, failures and problems.

 

[Hmmm!!!]

The FJ having good MPG? I find that hard to believe. It has the same engine as the previous 4runner and weighs over 5,000 lbs

I got to my FJ Cruiser around the same time that HooDoo did. And I have had other bigger, 4 wheel drive SUV's. By their very nature a 4 wheel drive vehicle is not going to get Miata miles per gallon. It's got a V6 engine while others may have thirstier V8's. And I frankly think that it gets better than average miles per gallon. I get about 17 to 18 around town and about 22 to 23 on the highway. Granted this does not compare well to a Renegade but the Renegade is in a totally different, smaller class. The blind spot is no big deal, just takes a little time to get used to. I'm just happy all around with my FJ, which is why I have had it for so long.

 

[Indiana Jones]

IJ, it is not so much that it is new, they have been building and selling them in Europe since last summer. The real issue seems to be assembly quality or I should say the lack thereof.

The workmanship seems sloppy in a number of areas, how long does it take to properly train someone to join connectors, tighten a hose clamp or glue a blindspot sensor?

Is it possible the root causes are the Italian laws and or unions? I'm not sure of the whole situation but someone said the workers got paid even with the factory was closed, if true, maybe they are not allowed to fire poor performing employees and therefore it is pot luck on how good or how bad your Renegade will be assembled?

Or, is it the work ethic, out of sight, out of mind? That would explain the many hidden odd faults, failures and problems.

I agree 110% that build quality and QC is dog doo- doo. I have stated this elsewhere on this forum that the biggest problem is build quality and QC. I have no idea what Fiats training is, how they hire or who they hire or what they hire. It could be they hire a bunch of Malakas and throw them on the assembly line and its a learning curve on how to put them together or they had too much vino at lunch and just don't give a rats culo on what they are doing.

I do know, owning a 2nd year Abarth, that most of my issues were build quality and I am still "living" with bad build quality that never can be fixed. However, things seamed to improved on the third year. I am hoping this will be the case with the Renegade. If not it will be chow Fiat/ Renegade.

 

[WashingtonukPaul]

Hi, everyone, we have had a jeep renegade 1.6 turbo diesel limited model now , for three weeks,,and it is a great car to drive,and no problems at all, no wind noise, no smoking steering columns good MPG well built , a really punchy economical engine, compared to the 2.0 litre petrol engined Compass we had before, ,seats are more comfortable , gear change is better ,suspension, was atrocious on the Compass compared to the Renegade, if anyone thinks build quality on the Renegade is poor ,you should have tried Fiats in the seventies, eighties, and nineties, .